Separate chat tab for Tag/Singles/Ranked Duels

[Quan]

Hi,

I suggested to ひまわり about having the chat and card info in different tabs.

Interaction of players in Team tag games have a lot of communication when playing with each other and communicating about effects. In Dueling Network, we used to be able communicate about effects in manual mode and be able to copy paste effects into the the card info tab box.

I think having different icons that would open each Window would be nice to have not only for PC users. I know that you mentioned that we do have hotkeys for this but mobile players do not have hotkeys when playing. I think competitively Tag players must communicate to their partners when playing an Tag game about their strategy. While doing combos we can’t read what our partner says at the same time someone reads the card effects of an card.

Having 2 different box or an way to tap the chat box would really be helpful for mobile players but also pc players. In YGOPro, there was an reason they made the chat that way because you’re able to still type to your teamate while also reading about the card effect. I think about what omega does is that it makes you remember each card effect text and information much harder to remember because of the multitude of cards you have to remember while doing an combo.

In Tag, it is much harder as well because they play different decks as well and not every partner knows what their partner is playing. If our partner gets an random partner they won’t know which deck to synchronize and play to be able to do the optimal plays while gaming. I’ve noticed that you said it was « useless » but I think it’s not as useless because having to switch back and forth is indeed annoying and also makes it even harder when theirs an timer behind it. You can’t possibly look at every card then switch back to the chat then look at every effect then go back to the tab and try to explain to your partner. Their is an time constraint between each. I think theirs multiples things this also could be useful for. On Chrome it allows you do move freely the Tabs you want and also combine them. I think this suggestion is similar to that of what this function does.

[AntiMetaman]

This suggestion isn’t new, but let me simplify what your suggestion actually is in one sentence:

“I would like to have a separate tab for chatting with teammates in a Tag Duel.”

That is your suggestion. Now, the reason we cannot have this is simply due to the way Discord works. YGO Omega has been integrated with Discord. That means each time you are dueling with someone, a discord lobby in fact has been created between you and your opponent. When other players join your game as spectators, they are joining that same lobby id. That is why we cannot have a separate chat just for Spectators like in Dueling Book / Dueling Network.

At the same time, you already have an option to mute spectators so that you can only see your opponent chat messages. You also have the option to hide opponent and see spectators. You can toggle this from the settings at any time.

Now, we come to the suggestion of having a separate tab for just your tag partner. How do you think we do this today in ygopro and for the last 8 years? For the last 8 years, tag partners are using a third party program like Discord to communicate via voice chat. This is how they communicate with each other during the tag duel without informing their opponent’s team of the strategy. The same thing can be done by using Discord. Remember that Discord is already needed to play YGO Omega, which means that both you and your tag partner are already on Discord. It doesn’t take a lot of extra steps hence, to open a line of communication between you and your tag partner (which you should already know beforehand otherwise why are they you in a team?).

So in conclusion, the idea of a separate tab for tag duels has been proposed before and it cannot be implemented due to the way Discord works. We cannot separate the chats because all are connected to the same lobby id.

Now, let me also correct some additional misunderstandings in this post:

I suggested to ひまわり about having the chat and card info in different tabs.

We currently have a chat tab and a card info tab. We’ve had this for a couple of months now.

In Dueling Network, we used to be able communicate about effects in manual mode and be able to copy paste effects into the the card info tab box.

YGO Omega has a Manual Mode. You can already communicate with your opponent in the exact same way about any card effects the same way you could in DN or DB. This is nothing new. You can copy paste effects even by right clicking on the display pic. You have a card log even.

Having 2 different box or an way to tap the chat box would really be helpful for mobile players but also pc players.

Mobile players already can tap the chat icon to chat. This doesn’t circumvent the need for a keyboard. Even on mobile, players have to type somehow. This requires a keyboard. The only alternative is voice chat which can convert your voice to text. Professional mobile card games like Duel Links, Vanguard, and Hearthstone don’t even provide chat due to this reason but have the options of pressing preset messages like “Good Luck!” or “Good Game!”. This also avoids them having to monitor chat for toxicity or offensive words.

In YGOPro, there was an reason they made the chat that way because you’re able to still type to your teamate while also reading about the card effect. I think about what omega does is that it makes you remember each card effect text and information much harder to remember because of the multitude of cards you have to remember while doing an combo.

In YGOPro, while you are chatting, you aren’t reading a card effect - you are chatting. Once a chat message is sent, you can never retrieve the chat history again. That’s how it works in YGOPro. That means there is no record of any conversations. Everything is lost. A chat tab allows one to go back and read chat history. This is especially important for a manual duel because a record of the chat is needed for a Judge to look and judge the game state. This hence, was a flaw in YGOPro that there was no chat tab. In official konami games like Yugioh Online - they had a separate chat tab.

In addition, at any point during the duel if you are chatting and want to read a card effect, one simply needs to tab on the card and hold it. You have many options to read a card. If you are in the middle of reading a card and don’t want the display pic to update on hover or when an opponent summons/activates a new card, simply use the card lock icon that’s on the field (this was added in the latest update). Furthermore, you can hold CTRL while reading and the display pic will never update.

You can also right click on a card effect or simply read the card log to go back and click on a card name to see what card was revealed or used in a prior turn or move. This is the same even in Dueling Book where we use logs a lot for manual duels.

In Tag, it is much harder as well because they play different decks as well and not every partner knows what their partner is playing. If our partner gets an random partner they won’t know which deck to synchronize and play to be able to do the optimal plays while gaming.

Tag Duels are not something new. We’ve had them in ygopro for the last 8 years. You should know how to synchronize with a tag partner even before a duel starts. The rules of tag didn’t change. The core is the same. If you chose to play with a random tag partner that you have no idea of what deck they are using - then that’s what you signed up for. That means you have to learn how to synchronize on the fly. This has nothing to do with the simulator. This can happen in ygopro or in real life.

You can’t possibly look at every card then switch back to the chat then look at every effect then go back to the tab and try to explain to your partner. Their is an time constraint between each. I think theirs multiples things this also could be useful for. On Chrome it allows you do move freely the Tabs you want and also combine them. I think this suggestion is similar to that of what this function does.

If you’re having to look at every card and read it and then switch back to the chat, then the issue is about not having knowledge on the cards themselves. If a beginner Yugioh player were to play ygopro right now, they would state exactly the same thing. They would say, “I don’t have enough time to read the cards because I’m unfamiliar with them.” Online automatic simulators do have a time for turn for a reason. That timer is dynamic and is based on actions. As long as there is an action, the time will not decrease. This is more than forgiving. In real life, there is a time per round of 40 mins which leads to slow play abuse and winning by EOMP (End of Match Procedures).

[Quan]

@AntiMetaman

We currently have a chat tab and a card info tab. We’ve had this for a couple of months now.

That’s not what I meant. I was saying having an card info tab and chat tab separate from each other. Where you can freely move them elsewhere and separate them

@AntiMetaman

YGO Omega has a Manual Mode. You can already communicate with your opponent in the exact same way about any card effects the same way you could in DN or DB. This is nothing new. You can copy paste effects even by right clicking on the display pic. You have a card log even.

You’re able to right click and copy paste only with Rush Duel and Standard currently but what I’m talking is about having an button when you’re not using the Card artwork to copy paste which is the Text box.

@AntiMetaman

In YGOPro, while you are chatting, you aren’t reading a card effect - you are chatting. Once a chat message is sent, you can never retrieve the chat history again. That’s how it works in YGOPro. That means there is no record of any conversations. Everything is lost. A chat tab allows one to go back and read chat history. This is especially important for a manual duel because a record of the chat is needed for a Judge to look and judge the game state. This hence, was a flaw in YGOPro that there was no chat tab. In official konami games like Yugioh Online - they had a separate chat tab.

In addition, at any point during the duel if you are chatting and want to read a card effect, one simply needs to tab on the card and hold it. You have many options to read a card. If you are in the middle of reading a card and don’t want the display pic to update on hover or when an opponent summons/activates a new card, simply use the card lock icon that’s on the field (this was added in the latest update). Furthermore, you can hold CTRL while reading and the display pic will never update.

You can also right-click on a card effect or simply read the card log to go back and click on a card name to see what card was revealed or used in a prior turn or move. This is the same even in Dueling Book where we use logs a lot for manual duels.

In Edopro their is an chat history. The thing is what I want is to be simultaneously communicate with my partner while also be able to type beforehand and read the card effect before he does something wrong. I think this could be furthermore aliviate the need to switch from different Tabs to another if we had both of them opened at the same time in different windows. See how Health bars are done? They are separate from the card Tab. An way to Seperate them but also an way to put them back in the Tab. It is much like chrome when you open an window and then you move that window to an different tab it combines them.

@AntiMetaman

Tag Duels are not something new. We’ve had them in ygopro for the last 8 years. You should know how to synchronize with a tag partner even before a duel starts. The rules of tag didn’t change. The core is the same. If you chose to play with a random tag partner that you have no idea of what deck they are using - then that’s what you signed up for. That means you have to learn how to synchronize on the fly. This has nothing to do with the simulator. This can happen in ygopro or in real life.

I think you’re really misunderstanding what I’ve wanted to actually point out and failed to understand what what was my point was. This isn’t just for Tags as I’ve said above it is also for single duels and tag tournaments. If our partners play randoms decks you want to emphasize on the communication with your partner. In DevPro we used to have an Whisper system where we could communicate with each player within the game. I think if the person isn’t in the discord and is playing the game how else do you expect people to communicate with each other? Also will you look to find on how to type characters that you can’t type on discord. I think something that would redirect to that person discord DMS would be indeed an good way to communicate in private between teammates.

@AntiMetaman

If you’re having to look at every card and read it and then switch back to the chat, then the issue is about not having knowledge on the cards themselves. If a beginner Yugioh player were to play ygopro right now, they would state exactly the same thing. They would say, “I don’t have enough time to read the cards because I’m unfamiliar with them.” Online automatic simulators do have a time for turn for a reason. That timer is dynamic and is based on actions. As long as there is an action, the time will not decrease. This is more than forgiving. In real life, there is a time per round of 40 mins which leads to slow play abuse and winning by EOMP (End of Match Procedures).

Again one can’t possibly learn someone’s decks in Tags. Furthermore, communicating about Strategy during a duel is crucial. Theirs a reason in every Team games communication is essential to win a game in a competitive environment.

[AntiMetaman]

@Quan

That’s not what I meant. I was saying having an card info tab and chat tab separate from each other. Where you can freely move them elsewhere and separate them

Having separate tabs not inside the same box? Yea, that’s not ever going to happen. All tabs are in the same box. That’s how it is in all games. You can’t simply drag a tab outside its box. Not only does that create more UI problems, but it’s just a bad idea.

I understand you want to basically read a card while typing a chat message, but I’ve already given the use case where you can do this already. I can already read a card in Omega and chat at the same time because of zooming to read the card effect.

@Quan

You’re able to right click and copy paste only with Rush Duel and Standard currently but what I’m talking is about having an button when you’re not using the Card artwork to copy paste which is the Text box.

Well of course. The anime style doesn’t contain card text as it is designed that way, so there’s nothing to copy from. If you want to copy the text to clipboard from the chat box - that is possible. You can highlight card text in the chat box and copy it already.

@Quan

In Edopro their is an chat history. The thing is what I want is to be simultaneously communicate with my partner while also be able to type beforehand and read the card effect before he does something wrong. I think this could be furthermore aliviate the need to switch from different Tabs to another if we had both of them opened at the same time in different windows. See how Health bars are done? They are separate from the card Tab. An way to Seperate them but also an way to put them back in the Tab. It is much like chrome when you open an window and then you move that window to an different tab it combines them.

You cannot communicate with your tag partner in any ygopro without also communicating with your opponents. All chat messages are visible to everyone in the duel. You can only show/hide messages between spectators and duelists.

You’re again pointing out a use case where you can only read a card using the chat box and you need to chat at the same time. The entire premise behind YGO Omega was to learn to click+hold on a card to zoom and read it. That’s why we have automatic card generation so that you read the text on the card itself. We’ve had competitive players who played ygopro for 5+ years and have no problem with this. We’ve even had competitive players from Dueling Book who don’t use the chat box to read cards ever because they can simply zoom to read it like in real life when picking up a card.

Also note that the only time where you need to simultaneously read a card and also communicate with your opponent is during a manual duel. In a manual duel, you have no time limit. You can spend as much time as you want reading a card, going back to it, etc. Manual duels are not ranked.

@Quan

I think you’re really misunderstanding what I’ve wanted to actually point out and failed to understand what what was my point was. This isn’t just for Tags as I’ve said above it is also for single duels and tag tournaments. If our partners play randoms decks you want to emphasize on the communication with your partner. In DevPro we used to have an Whisper system where we could communicate with each player within the game. I think if the person isn’t in the discord and is playing the game how else do you expect people to communicate with each other? Also will you look to find on how to type characters that you can’t type on discord. I think something that would redirect to that person discord DMS would be indeed an good way to communicate in private between teammates.

Not failing to understand anything. First of all, you shouldn’t be playing with a random tag partner. Tag duels are done with partners that you know before the duel starts, so that the decks can be synergized. Second, ygopro used a whisper system because it didn’t have discord.

I have already told you in the above post how Discord works. I’ve already explained to you how whisper is not possible. I’ve already stated that Discord is required to play the game which means both you and your tag partner are already on discord. That means you can effectively simply talk to your tag partner on discord which serves the same purpose. We’ve hosted competitive tag team tournaments with 128 people and they all used Discord to communicate through voice chat.

Any characters you can’t type on discord - you can certainly not type on YGO Omega either. YGO Omega supports 13 languages already, that’s more than Genshin Impact does. If there are any characters beyond those languages - too bad.

@Quan

Again one can’t possibly learn someone’s decks in Tags. Furthermore, communicating about Strategy during a duel is crucial. Theirs a reason in every Team games communication is essential to win a game in a competitive environment.

Again, we’ve already had tag duel events and this was never an issue stated by anyone. If you do not know your tag partner’s deck, then that is your problem. It is important for both players in a team to know each other’s deck before the duel even starts. The time you are spending to read and learn what cards do - you could have saved by learning beforehand. This is analogous to a new player reading every card in real life resulting in slow play.

[Quan]

@AntiMetaman

Not failing to understand anything. First of all, you shouldn’t be playing with a random tag partner. Tag duels are done with partners that you know before the duel starts, so that the decks can be synergized. Second, ygopro used a whisper system because it didn’t have discord.

I have already told you in the above post how Discord works. I’ve already explained to you how whisper is not possible. I’ve already stated that Discord is required to play the game which means both you and your tag partner are already on discord. That means you can effectively simply talk to your tag partner on discord which serves the same purpose. We’ve hosted competitive tag team tournaments with 128 people and they all used Discord to communicate through voice chat.

Any characters you can’t type on discord - you can certainly not type on YGO Omega either. YGO Omega supports 13 languages already, that’s more than Genshin Impact does. If there are any characters beyond those languages - too bad.

I think trying to find someone on Discord will be hard because what if they aren’t in the discord in the first place and they left? How are you able to communicate to him/her in private about strategy. How do you find an name or Tag someone’s else name if you’re unable to type out their name? Kunogi had to change her name because no one could tag or find her in the Discord except to those who have her added. The discord does not show an full list of all the people in the discord and if they have offline mode it sure will not show them.

@AntiMetaman

Well of course. The anime style doesn’t contain card text as it is designed that way, so there’s nothing to copy from. If you want to copy the text to clipboard from the chat box - that is possible. You can highlight card text in the chat box and copy it already.

I have just tested this and I can confirm this isn’t possible. You cannot highlight the text in the chat box.

Having separate tabs not inside the same box? Yea, that’s not ever going to happen. All tabs are in the same box. That’s how it is in all games. You can’t simply drag a tab outside its box. Not only does that create more UI problems, but it’s just a bad idea.

@AntiMetaman

Having separate tabs not inside the same box? Yea, that’s not ever going to happen. All tabs are in the same box. That’s how it is in all games. You can’t simply drag a tab outside its box. Not only does that create more UI problems, but it’s just a bad idea.

I understand you want to basically read a card while typing a chat message, but I’ve already given the use case where you can do this already. I can already read a card in Omega and chat at the same time because of zooming to read the card effect.

You can do this but that’s with using the zoom function. I do not want to use the zoom function while reading an card effect. I want to be able to see the state of the field while my opponent is still playing cards and effects. I think I indeed agree with you that it would have problems with the UI by merging in and out. Also not every games are in the same box. in league of legends, your still able to read what other people say in the chat while reading your abilities. Smite also has that. Heroes of the Storm also has that.

[AntiMetaman]

@Quan

I think trying to find someone on Discord will be hard because what if they aren’t in the discord in the first place and they left? How are you able to communicate to him/her in private about strategy. How do you find an name or Tag someone’s else name if you’re unable to type out their name? Kunogi had to change her name because no one could tag or find her in the Discord except to those who have her added. The discord does not show an full list of all the people in the discord and if they have offline mode it sure will not show them.

If you do not even know who your tag partner is on discord and are not friends with them, why are you in a team with them? This goes again back to random tag partner. Everyone is on Discord. Discord is required to play omega. You literally cannot play YGO Omega without a discord account. It’s simple to even ask your tag partner what their discord name is in the omega chat and then communicate with them on Discord. There’s absolutely no excuse. We’ve been doing this for the last 8 years for tag duels.

@Quan

I have just tested this and I can confirm this isn’t possible. You cannot highlight the text in the chat box.

We can check that then. This is the only thing you’ve stated so far that if it isn’t already implemented, can be possible.

@Quan

You can do this but that’s with using the zoom function. I do not want to use the zoom function while reading an card effect. I want to be able to see the state of the field while my opponent is still playing cards and effects. I think I indeed agree with you that it would have problems with the UI by merging in and out. Also not every games are in the same box. in league of legends, your still able to read what other people say in the chat while reading your abilities. Smite also has that. Heroes of the Storm also has that.

This is again about what is possible. You want something but fail to understand the developer’s perspective. You only understand what you want as a user. You want the ability to see the field, the chat, and read the card. Your eyes can only see one thing at a time. Even if all things are visible, you will be reading one thing at a time. At a certain point, one has to ask if memory is a problem with a player. If it is, then that’s a separate issue.

If you want to see the field, then look at the field. If you want to read the card, then click on the card and read it. If you forgot already in that instance what the field looks like, click on the field again and look at it. In an automatic duel, in all my years, I’ve never had to chat while also reading card effects because I am playing an automatic duel. You never have to ever chat in an automatic duel ever for anything. If it is a manual duel, you have all the time in the world. Dueling Book is a manual simulator and it takes on average, an hour to complete 1 duel.

[Quan]

@AntiMetaman

If you do not even know who your tag partner is on discord and are not friends with them, why are you in a team with them? This goes again back to random tag partner. Everyone is on Discord. Discord is required to play omega. You literally cannot play YGO Omega without a discord account. It’s simple to even ask your tag partner what their discord name is in the omega chat and then communicate with them on Discord. There’s absolutely no excuse. We’ve been doing this for the last 8 years for tag duels.

I think you don’t understand how I met some of the great Tag players back in the day. In DevPro we used to be able to talk to other players via communicating them by right clicking their name. And this is how I made many friends while I was playing Tag. And I’m not saying that if you uninstalled Discord. I’m saying if that person has left the Omega Server. How will you find that person on discord? perhaps something that lets use copy/paste their name and Tag would be good. Even if it’s random players. Basically, you are saying to play only with your friends. But that’s not what I’m about. I’m about finding new good players and if we made something that let us just redirected us to the Discord Chat or let us highlight the name so we can add them as friend. We can now contact them.

@AntiMetaman

We can check that then. This is the only thing you’ve stated so far that if it isn’t already implemented, can be possible.

I’ve already tested it but feel free to double check. I’ve tested in both 1v1, Tag, spectator mode and replays.

@AntiMetaman

This is again about what is possible. You want something but fail to understand the developer’s perspective. You only understand what you want as a user. You want the ability to see the field, the chat, and read the card. Your eyes can only see one thing at a time. Even if all things are visible, you will be reading one thing at a time. At a certain point, one has to ask if memory is a problem with a player. If it is, then that’s a separate issue.

If you want to see the field, then look at the field. If you want to read the card, then click on the card and read it. If you forgot already in that instance what the field looks like, click on the field again and look at it. In an automatic duel, in all my years, I’ve never had to chat while also reading card effects because I am playing an automatic duel. You never have to ever chat in an automatic duel ever for anything. If it is a manual duel, you have all the time in the world. Dueling Book is a manual simulator and it takes on average, an hour to complete 1 duel.

I think that it’s still essential. look at how Genshin or any other game that has a chat function. You’re still able to multitask. I’m able to read my card effects while still be able to read the chat at the same time. But I’m here to contest what you’ve previously said. It’s about efficiency not the speed.

[AntiMetaman]

@Quan

I think you don’t understand how I met some of the great Tag players back in the day. In DevPro we used to be able to talk to other players via communicating them by right clicking their name. And this is how I made many friends while I was playing Tag. And I’m not saying that if you uninstalled Discord. I’m saying if that person has left the Omega Server. How will you find that person on discord? perhaps something that lets use copy/paste their name and Tag would be good. Even if it’s random players. Basically, you are saying to play only with your friends. But that’s not what I’m about. I’m about finding new good players and if we made something that let us just redirected us to the Discord Chat or let us highlight the name so we can add them as friend. We can now contact them.

We’re back on the subject of “How do I find them on Discord?”. How do you think we managed to do tag team tournaments of 128 people? Let’s say they left all discord servers that you are in. You can still find them. How? Very easy. You simply ask them what their discord name is. That’s it. It doesn’t require some great effort. It’s been done for the last 8 years and will continue to be done for many more years. What you want is an in-game friend system when there’s already Discord. We aren’t trying to make another discord. The entire point of integrating with discord was so that discord takes care of all the social stuff so that we don’t have to.

@Quan

I think that it’s still essential. look at how Genshin or any other game that has a chat function. You’re still able to multitask. I’m able to read my card effects while still be able to read the chat at the same time. But I’m here to contest what you’ve previously said. It’s about efficiency not the speed.

I can say that simultaneously reading the card effect and looking at the field is good to have. That however, is already do-able. What you’re asking is simultaneuosly chatting, looking at the field, AND reading the card effect.

Let’s say you’re in the middle of chatting - a pop-up appears asking you whether to chain the card. You’re chatting, so you may accidentally press something on the keyboard as a hotkey to close that prompt. Now of course, we made it to disable all hotkeys while typing, but now you have to finish what you’re typing to continue the game.

At no point ever in an automatic duel - ranked or otherwise, requires chatting ever. In a tag duel, use discord to communicate with the player. If you don’t know their discord name - simply ask. Problem solved.

[Quan]

@AntiMetaman

We’re back on the subject of “How do I find them on Discord?”. How do you think we managed to do tag team tournaments of 128 people? Let’s say they left all discord servers that you are in. You can still find them. How? Very easy. You simply ask them what their discord name is. That’s it. It doesn’t require some great effort. It’s been done for the last 8 years and will continue to be done for many more years. What you want is an in-game friend system when there’s already Discord. We aren’t trying to make another discord. The entire point of integrating with discord was so that discord takes care of all the social stuff so that we don’t have to.

What if you’re unable to type Foreign Characters to search for them in the Discord. They tell you their name but then you can’t find them. Why letting us copy their name by right clicking their name in the duel. You see the healthbars and names. why not let us highlight their name so it automatically copies to clipboard when you hit an button.

[AntiMetaman]

@Quan

What if you’re unable to type Foreign Characters to search for them in the Discord. They tell you their name but then you can’t find them. Why letting us copy their name by right clicking their name in the duel. You see the healthbars and names. why not let us highlight their name so it automatically copies to clipboard when you hit an button.

You can copy paste exactly what they said their discord name is. You can copy paste any foreign characters. If there are any characters that you can’t copy paste, then discord wouldn’t allow those characters to be used as a username in the first place.

That’s a good suggestion. Highlighting the username from the LP bar and allowing to copy it to clipboard. That I will agree is a good suggestion.

[Quan]

@AntiMetaman

I can say that simultaneously reading the card effect and looking at the field is good to have. That however, is already do-able. What you’re asking is simultaneuosly chatting, looking at the field, AND reading the card effect.

Let’s say you’re in the middle of chatting - a pop-up appears asking you whether to chain the card. You’re chatting, so you may accidentally press something on the keyboard as a hotkey to close that prompt. Now of course, we made it to disable all hotkeys while typing, but now you have to finish what you’re typing to continue the game.

At no point ever in an automatic duel - ranked or otherwise, requires chatting ever. In a tag duel, use discord to communicate with the player. If you don’t know their discord name - simply ask. Problem solved.

Also this could be also useful for the Card Log Tab not just the Chat Log Tab. As you’re able to see what they have done, while also looking and read the card effect.